By RegularMom

August 15, 2011 7:21 AM | Link to this

I guess I don’t get why this has to become such a heated debate. As a Christian, I would actually prefer to teach my children about God at home. There are several ways that Christianity can be skewed by professing “Christians” and I want to avoid that and take responsibility of that as the Bible commands us to do. So, I do not think it is a good idea to teach creationism at schools, though that is our wholehearted belief. However, I think it is overboard to not allow Christian groups to form in schools or to not allow anyone to mention God. Why is that so threatening? Especially when everyone is so tolerant and accommodating to other religions like Islam. I don’t get why just mentioning God is so threatening to other parents. Should it be a part of the curriculum? No. But, to say “…One nation, under God…” is not going to scar anyone. If the curriculum brushes on evolution, fine. Micro-evolution surely does exist and has been affirmed. I get it. However, don’t tell my child that God does not exist. Don’t tell my child that her parents are wrong. If you don’t want it mentioned, then don’t mention it. Cover what you consider “facts” and I’ll take care of the rest at home, but you need to tell them that it is a theory, because…well…IT IS. And, just to clear this up, here is the actual definition of a theory: 1. a coherent group of tested general propositions, commonly regarded as correct, that can be used as principles of explanation and prediction for a class of phenomena. 2. a proposed explanation whose status is still conjectural and subject to experimentation, in contrast to well-established propositions that are regarded as reporting matters of actual fact.

By Another View

August 9, 2011 11:42 AM | Link to this

Concerned citizens should be concerned about the brainwashing “union first” religion mandated in our public school by the Ohio Education Association. The OEA needs to keep its left-wing views outside of the classroom and its hands off our kids’ curriculum. The OEA dictates to teachers in their monthly newsletter, “It’s essential that they not only be teacher unionists, but teachers of unionism.” How about our teachers union leave their political ideology and religion of unionism out of the classroom?

By Jon Hendry

August 7, 2011 12:01 AM | Link to this

The latest story on this says of Kohls: ” she now wants parents of students in public schools to have options if they want their children to learn about theories like intelligent design.” They already have the option. It’s called church. It’s called the internet. It’s called Barnes & Noble. If they want their children to learn about theories like ID, they ought to be able to go to a church and borrow relevant materials. Such materials ought to be donated by churchgoers, or purchased by the church out of donated funds. Churches already have tax-free status, they shouldn’t be expecting the taxpayer to foot the bill to spread a particular belief of a segment of the religious population. There is zero need for taxpayer funding for this. That said, many public libraries probably carry relevant books. If, as I suspect, Kohls’ real problem is the people who don’t go to creationist churches, or to churches at all, then I suggest she get crackin’ the old fashioned way and start the hard work to persuade people to visit such churches of their own free will and in their own time. Not trying to use government to indoctrinate students in creationism and “intelligent design”. I suspect, in this economic environment, she might have more luck getting people into church if the focus were more on helping the poor and less fortunate, and less on silly quixotic tilting at evolution.

By enlashok

August 3, 2011 9:44 PM | Link to this

Dear Squirrellygirl: The Bible should be kept out of science class for the same reason that the Koran (which you despise so much) should also be kept out of science classes: Science classes are for science, that is: building and evaluating competing testable models that describe the way the world works and help us make useful predictions. Creationism (and ‘Intelligent Design’) is not testable, does not make any predictions and therefore is not science. Even supposing that the two (conflicting) accounts in Genesis 1 and 2 were somehow actually true, Creationism/ID would still not be science, because it isn’t testable and doesn’t make any useful predictions. (You might also be know that ‘In God We Trust’ was adopted as a motto in the same decade that ‘Under God’ was added to the pledge of allegiance- during the 1950s!! It was the Cold War, a cynical attempt to take US citizens unite against the scary evil communist / socialist bugbear (one that it seems you somehow still feel threatened by.)

By seabass

August 3, 2011 8:46 PM | Link to this

@ Squirrellygirl You obviously don’t even have a basic understanding of evolution, which is clear. Evolution can and has been demonstrated time and time again. Don’t you wonder why there’s a new flu vaccine each year? The virus has evolved. The theory of evolution has either indirectly or directly contributed to every aspect of biology. In fact, it’s the central idea in biology. It’s easy to put in earplugs and yell “la la la” without actually taking the time to understand the concepts behind biology. I’d find your comments hilarious if they weren’t so depressing and frightening.

By Gene Goldring

August 3, 2011 7:21 PM | Link to this

@angry tax payer Teaching Creationism/Intelligent Design would not make schools safer. It would actually do the opposite. Scientific knowledge is not subjective where religion right off the bat teaches that reason is optional. Creationism/I.D. in light of common and current scientific knowledge is a lie and when kids find this out for them selves they start distrusting everything. Creationism/I.D. is a sectarian religious belief and by it’s self cannot be taught in public schools. Within a comparative religion class, yes it can. It cannot be taught in science class period. As a scientific theory it fails completely as it doesn’t even make it to the hypothesis stage. Read the Wedge Document to see that I.D. is only meant as a stealth method of getting religion into public schools. Read the court case kitzmiller v. Dover to find out how this will play out in court and do nothing but cost the school district money. Thne smart money is in shutting the 2 nitwits up that want to cost the schools money.

By herpderpcreationism

August 3, 2011 6:10 PM | Link to this

angry tax payer: Funny you should mention that, when I get hurt or my parents fall ill, I turn to doctors. They do this really cool thing called “existing” that God just can’t do.

By Nick

August 3, 2011 4:41 PM | Link to this

@Shepard, stop reading BS religious sites to come up with “facts”. Evolution is proven by the fossil record, and ALL reputable scientists believe it.

By Anon

August 3, 2011 4:10 PM | Link to this

“Everything came from somewhere. If you say it is the big bang, then where did it come from initially?” So Squirrely Girl, where did God or any other religious diety come from?

By brucemo

August 3, 2011 3:44 PM | Link to this

If creationism is taught in the local schools, someone will sue the district, and the district will lose. Guaranteed. Any money spent by the district defending against the lawsuit will be wasted. The only people who benefit will be the lawyers. If someone is going to run on a platform of fiscal conservatism, you’d think they’d have enough sense not to waste the district’s money.

By Jason

August 3, 2011 3:25 PM | Link to this

I am SHOCKED at the level of ignorance in these comments. Everyone here who says “Just a theory” needs to read a science book before they comment. Gravity is a theory. Germ Theory is a theory Electricity is a theory. A theory is the highest form of scientific knowledge and is not to be confused with the notion that it is “merely” anything, and certainly not to be confused with “hypothesis”. A theory is a scientific model for the mechanism for a fact. Is a testable, observable, repeatable model that produces predicable results. It is NOT a guess. It is NOT an opinion. It is NOT a suggestion. Evolution happened. This is a fact. It is backed by mountains of evidence and the theory of evolution explains that fact. Creationism IS opinion. It is NOT science. It is NOT testable. It is NOT observable. It is NOT scientific. Lets be clear. The evolution “VS” creationism is not a debate between any two groups. It is only a debate in the eyes of those who don’t understand science. I am not making any comment on the existence of god, I am trying to point out that creationism is not science, and as such does not belong in the classroom. Just because you have an idea (creationism) doesn’t mean that it holds equal scientific merit to an actual scientific theory. Come on now. Enough. Creationism doesn’t get a “side” in the debate, until it gets the evidence to create a model for reality. Until then, you keep religion in your churches, and we will keep science in our classrooms. Never the twain shall meet.

By Seamus Ruah

August 3, 2011 2:34 PM | Link to this

You Creationists don’t teach religion in our schools and I won’t teach Science in your churches…agreed?

By Anon

August 3, 2011 2:22 PM | Link to this

The first thing I ask anyone who promotes the teaching of creationism, or whatever it is they call it this decade, is to tell me what exactly the curriculum would be. What are you going to teach? Once they realize the textbook for that class would be something like: Chapter 1 - God did it The End

By dlandes

August 3, 2011 2:22 PM | Link to this

Shepard, you’re the one lacking in education here. The fossil record shows us exactly what evolutionary biology predicted it would! However, I doubt you’ll take my word for it, so I’ll go a little deeper. Suppose I told you that we had a perfect and continuous day-by-day and year-by-year fossil accounting of an entire taxonomic phylum (where a Phylum is a rank just below Kingdom, such as the Animal Kingdom or the Plant Kingdom) of life, consisting of over 275,000 distinct fossil species with all the minor changes between each, going all the way back to the mid-Jurassic period. What would you say to that? The thing is, we have this. The phylum I spoke of is Foraminifera, and the sea floor is littered with a nearly limitless supply of fossils of its numerous species as they rain down from above, piling up in chronological order. All you need to do is drop a pipe into the ocean floor and you can pull up a segment of their history, which shows clearly that it changed and branched out over time. They evolved, and this fossil evidence for it isn’t even the most compelling evidence for evolution, because it ignore the far more compelling case made by genetics.

By Jim

August 3, 2011 2:14 PM | Link to this

wow… The apparent amount of disregard for intelligence in relation to our school system is staggering. Skip the next two paragraphs if you want some constructive thoughts on why not teaching creationism is good. Read the next two if you want to see why other posters here are just wrong and dumb. To Squirlygirl… In case you didn’t know, public school is socialism. You don’t have to pay to send your kids to school, to make sure they are educated, that is the government taking care of the people. Public school is socialism. If your house is burning down, and you dial 911 and the fire department comes without promise of payback… that is socialism. You’re house is being broke into, and you don’t have to pay your police from your pocket to come and rescue you, that is socialism. Make sure you understand what you are arguing against before you start speaking. You don’t like socialism, move to a gated community where you pay for things like that, and put your kids in private school, and bam, your socialism problems are fixed. Wanna fix Unions? Easy, get your government to pass laws to make sure workers are treated fairly, paid well for what they do, so that workers don’t need representation. Moving on to the subject at hand. Teaching creationism has no intrinsic value. As we know if it, it will not help you in any career other than being a priest, but apparently knowing how to find Kiddie porn will help you with that too.. (Rolls eyes) Teaching evolution helps in biological sciences. it helps you predict modeled behavior, as well as understand reactions. High school students who are not as well versed in evolution, but understand creationism go to college, and are more likely to drop out or fail out. Also Creationism isn’t a theory under the strictest sense of science. In the scientific method, you make an observation, you make a hypothesis on how it works, you test it see if it fits the model. if it fits the model, it can be elevetated to ‘theory’ until it is disproven. Science measures the world of the natural. god is supernatural in his existence. Hence creationism can never be tested in science, because saying that ‘God dunnit’ is not a valid scientific point. Creationism is a hypothesis, and cannot be proven or disproven.. So teaching this as a theory is nothing short of giving a huge disservice to your children. As for morality, you don’t need ten commandments to be good, or even god. Just an understanding of how it feels to be hurt. if you know how it feels to be hurt, then a good person, will be able to empathize with his peers, and will not want to hurt them. teaching a child to empathize, is the parents’ job, not the school’s job, and certainly not the televisions job, though it is nice when both of the other two help out.

By dlandes

August 3, 2011 2:04 PM | Link to this

“Not there yet”, so-called “intelligent design” is not a theory at all, it is an unsupported hypothesis, a wild guess. In the end, it is at best an argument from incredulity, an admission from some individuals that they can’t understand the world without blaming some supernatural entity, so they feel the need to dress up their ignorance and try to get others to accept it. Evolutionary biology is a scientific theory, meaning it is supported by a preponderance of objective, empirical evidence, and it is a conclusion based on that evidence alone, without preconceptions. “Intelligent design” isn’t even a layman’s theory. Equivocating the two while using wildly different meanings of the word “theory” is, if I were being charitable, intellectually dishonest at best.

By dlandes

August 3, 2011 1:58 PM | Link to this

When scientists use the word theory, it has a different meaning to normal everyday use. That’s right, it all comes down to the multiple meanings of the word theory. If you said to a scientist that you didn’t believe in evolution because it was “just a theory”, they’d probably be a bit puzzled. In everyday use, theory means a guess or a hunch, something that maybe needs proof. In science, a theory is not a guess, not a hunch. It’s a well-substantiated, well-supported, well-documented explanation for our observations. It ties together all the facts about something, providing an explanation that fits all the observations and can be used to make predictions. In science, theory is the ultimate goal, the explanation. It’s as close to proven as anything in science can be. Some people think that in science, you have a theory, and once it’s proven, it becomes a law. That’s not how it works. In science, we collect facts, or observations, we use laws to describe them, and a theory to explain them. You don’t promote a theory to a law by proving it. A theory never becomes a law. This bears repeating. A theory never becomes a law. In fact, if there was a hierarchy of science, theories would be higher than laws. There is nothing higher, or better, than a theory.

By landslug

August 3, 2011 1:34 PM | Link to this

If you dont preach in our schools, we wont think in your church

By dublea

August 3, 2011 1:12 PM | Link to this

Here is the hard truth Christians fail to understand: Evolution is based on science and can be tested with results where-as Creationism is based off of ideas and faith and can not be tested with results. Also, people have a misinterpretation of theory and hypothesis. A scientific theory has to be tested, the results are always the same, and other scientists can test it and get the same results. An hypothesis is a figurative question that many scientist pose before doing tests. Usually it leads scientists to perform the right tests using logic. Overall, this so called Theory of Creation is NOT a theory at all. It is an hypothesis and nothing more!

By Gladidonthavekids

August 3, 2011 12:52 PM | Link to this

…or ever plan to. But if i did i would make sure they knew the true definition of “Theory.”

By angry tax payer

August 3, 2011 8:24 AM | Link to this

I read all these things about this and that GOD is this GOD is that. I don’t know any 5.00 words so I just tell it the way it is. It is because of the grace of god we are all here. All the people reading this and saying here is another crack pot. Let me ask you when you get hurt or one of your parents get ill, who do you turn to? If I were kelly Kohls I would put the 10 comandments on stones out front of springboro schools today. If just one kid saw them and was maybe planning to do harm to the school or a teacher,and thought about it, and it helped that child with his or her thoughts, and prevented another person being harmed, just think about it,just might be your child. We as parents can’t be everywhere all the time, god is everywhere all the time. I will always support Kelly and her fight to make schools a safe place to put your kids, you should do the same.

By r2

August 3, 2011 12:10 AM | Link to this

Creationism shouldn’t be taught in schools unless it is part of a larger course on mythology.

By Anonymous

August 3, 2011 12:09 AM | Link to this

If they’re going to teach creationism, they need to be force to teach every religion’s creation story (or at least every active religion’s creation story). YHVH made the world in 7 days (or rather El did, but that’s another matter), Izanagi and Izanami stood at the tower, etc. And they need to educate children that these are the words in a 4000+ year-old book written by people who couldn’t conceive of the thought of a cell, let alone advanced microbiology and observable evolution. It does not go against the idea of God to have an origin that is actually explainable by science, it’s merely that it didn’t happen the way it was written.

By Reader

August 2, 2011 10:30 PM | Link to this

The connection between the laughable Tea Party and this creation nonsense is very telling. The Tea Party is USING the middle class to destroy the middle class! Wake up people…the Tea Party is tearing this country apart!

By raiel

August 2, 2011 6:23 PM | Link to this

@Squirrellygirl obviously has no understanding of science and her arguments are laughable at best.

By Me

August 2, 2011 4:02 PM | Link to this

“Kohls was elected on a Tea Party platform of fiscal conservatism two years ago when the district was struggling to pass a school operating levy” Nice Try :) The equal statement is: All The Democrats who live in Springboro never go to church and don’t want it in their school either. Lets’ try and keep to the issue at hand instead of trying to make this about political affiliation?! Please? It’s not. Not EVERY Tea Party member wants this, not EVERY Democrat doesn’t.

By Brenda

August 2, 2011 3:56 PM | Link to this

I would like to point out that the word “theory” when used as a scientific term is much different that when used as a sociological or casual term. It does not mean “just an idea,” rather a theory is an explanation supported by evidence, evidence so significant that it is highly unlikely it will be disproved. Scientists do not use the term “theory” lightly.

By misunderstood

August 2, 2011 2:16 PM | Link to this

Teaching these two widely accepted theories would promote critical thinking. Ask the students to explain why either or both of these make sense. Insulting here is making you look thretened. Did you know that courses in Islam are being required in CA?

By Alli

August 2, 2011 2:08 PM | Link to this

I know you are a pro Levy campaigner (union thug) enough said? In 1987, the United States Supreme Court held in Edwards v. Aguillard (482 U.S. 578) that it is unconstitutional to require the teaching of creation science. In subsequent rulings, district courts held that individual teachers may not advocate creation science (for example, Webster v. New Lenox School District #122, 917 F. 2d. 1004; John E. Peloza v. Capistrano Unified School District, 37 F. 3d. 517).

By Alli

August 2, 2011 2:05 PM | Link to this

Just curious where did we start the degradation of the teaching of our moral background and isn’t that why the arabs , Muslims hate us. Maybe we should rebuild morality however we can. It is not illegal to teach creationism, people like to exagerate that. The left is working hard to fruther degrade our kids. In 1987, the United States Supreme Court held in Edwards v. Aguillard (482 U.S. 578) that it is unconstitutional to require the teaching of creation science. In subsequent rulings, district courts held that individual teachers may not advocate creation science (for example, Webster v. New Lenox School District #122, 917 F. 2d. 1004; John E. Peloza v. Capistrano Unified School District, 37 F. 3d. 517). For someone who espouses to support cost effective education in Springboro, it seems incongruent that you espouse for the teaching of creationism as part of the science curriculum in Springboro schools which would surely result in a large expensive lawsuit that would strike down any creationist curriculum based on previous precedent at the federal, state, and appelate levels.

By Randy

August 2, 2011 2:03 PM | Link to this

First let me correct you. ID/Creationism is not, IS NOT a theory. To become a theory takes actual research and work. Just because unscrupulous Christians steal the title to advance their cause does not make it true. Second, do science teachers come to your church and teach science? Do they barge into your home with evolution lessons? I don’t want my children subjected to that Christian filth, I want my children to have a future. Keep your religion in church and keep science in the classroom.

By FactCheck

August 2, 2011 12:49 PM | Link to this

Squirrellygirl: Evolution is fact. The theory is the mechanism which causes it. The theory is Natural Selection. “In God We Trust” was added to coins in the 1860s and adopted as a motto in the 1950s. Both occurred well after the founding of the country and has nothing to do with the Constitutional Convention. One way to get schools money, rather than “starve them” as you suggest, is to start making churches pay taxes like the rest of us.

By Jim

August 2, 2011 12:21 PM | Link to this

isnt church for teaching about the rants and raves of god? How bout teaching kids to be ready to work. Asked 4 18yo-22yo what 14/4 was the other day, never did get correct answer. FAIL

By Matt

August 2, 2011 11:12 AM | Link to this

Gravity is just a theory. I challenge anyone who doesn’t believe in Darwinian Natural Selection to jump out of a building to test the theory of gravity and ironically, natural selection.

By springboroResident

August 2, 2011 11:09 AM | Link to this

Intelligent design focuses on how something can come from nothing with strict laws (physics), and for life to appear through a perfect combination of events. You are severely misinformed of both intelligent design and christianity if you feel they are one in the same.Intelligent design and theories similiar to it has been gaining track in the scientific community for years. Just because a theory leaves the possiblity for a superior designer does not automatically relate it to a particular religion. I can understand the concern of teachers misrepresenting the theory and slanting it toward a religion, but some teachers have been forcing the religion of atheism for sometime without bringing concern (I know its not a religion but the courts seem to protect it as one)

By Matt

August 2, 2011 11:08 AM | Link to this

As if Springboro needed another reason to not send your kids to their schools…

By Squirrellygirl

August 2, 2011 9:23 AM | Link to this

Evolution is a theory taught in schools. It is a guess at how man came about. It is not accurate and can’t be proven. John W. is wrong, it is not reasonable to be taught in our schools. Man was created by God. Although I don’t want teachers putting their slant on things and pushing it on impressionable children, I don’t think our forefathers intended our laws to prohibit religion. And I believe you are wrong about our forefathers not being Christians. There are books with letters from our forefathers (the same ones you mentioned) that proves they believed in God. There is “In God We Trust” printed on our money, which proves our forefathers believed in God. You are wrong and should do more research to correct your information. I suggest you not use left wing propaganda when gathering your “facts”. Teachers don’t have the right to change our children’s minds about things like religion. That is not what we send our children to school for. Our teachers should be teaching things that children will use to get jobs, like math, English, sciences (not theories like evolution or abusing children like Freud). If the schools don’t have enough money to operate, check out their curriculum. If they are wasting money on special interests or left wing propaganda, starve them. They don’t need more money. And starve the unions, too. I’m tired of funding their political agenda.

By Maxwell Powers

August 2, 2011 2:21 AM | Link to this

We can save a lot of time and money by teaching the theories side by side… that said, no one says they have to have equal time. I see it this way: “Children, the theory of creationism holds that a Creator made all the universe in 6 days. No, I’m sorry, Johnny, I can’t answer any questions because Creationism is a based on Faith. You can’t test it, you just have to Believe it. Now, onto evolution, which is a complex, scientifically tested theory which will take me several weeks to explain fully…”

By Marcia

August 2, 2011 1:24 AM | Link to this

Scott said it best - the attempt to introduce religion into the classroom has been ruled on by the courts. Any subsequent attempts would be foolhardy and costly. I have supported previous levies, however, if this goes forward, I will never vote for another one until these board members are removed. I would also demand equal time for the Easter Bunny and Santa Claus!

By T

August 1, 2011 11:14 PM | Link to this

Springboro School Board- are you seriously considering this? Religion is based on faith. It isn’t something to be taught in a classroom. It is up to parents to teach their children about faith and up to schools to teach based on fact. I embarrassed for you Springboro.

By Jeremy

August 1, 2011 11:01 PM | Link to this

springboroResident, intelligent design is a front for Christianity. Saying it’s not is being disingenuous. And please show me an atheist claiming that their religious rights are being violated.

By Anne

August 1, 2011 8:12 PM | Link to this

I’m up to the challenge. Evolution is a fact. Natural seclection is the theory that best explains evolution.

By Mr. D'Agostino

August 1, 2011 8:09 PM | Link to this

I had no idea that there were so many backward people in Springboro…….

By Dave

August 1, 2011 4:28 PM | Link to this

There is a practical reason for separation of church and state. Local government can barely fix a road. Do you really think they can be trusted to teach religion to impressionable kids?

By springboroResident

August 1, 2011 3:20 PM | Link to this

Creationism has been theorized scientifically through mathematical odds much like black holes and others which are taught regulary in schools. The secular liberals have no problem abiding by this double standard. DDN puts its usual slant by saying religion will be taught. Intelligent design is not a religion and doesnt favor any in particular.Atheism is not a realigion I can never understand why people can say their religious rights are being violated when they dont have a religion. Its like claiming that your freedom of speach is being violated when your not even capable of speaking.

By John W.

August 1, 2011 3:08 PM | Link to this

A theory in science is simply an explanation. The theory of evolution effectively describes how plants, animals, and other forms of life have come, gone, and changed. It is reasonable to teach. A religion is a set of beliefs taken on faith. It is perfectly valid; however, it is not scientific. The separation of church and state dictates time and time again through the courts that teaching Creationism is illegal. Also, forth the information of many users, the Founding Fathers were mostly Deists (Franklin, Washington, Madison, Jefferson, Paine), not specifically Christians. Deism stresses that organized religion is not necessary and that order and nature are the places to find God. Therefore, saying that the US is based on Judeo-Christian values is not completely true.

By Teach SCIENCE

August 1, 2011 2:51 PM | Link to this

You are so afraid, Squirrellygirl, that young people will appreciate the facts for what they are and see that religion is mostly illogical fantasy created by ancient men to help them sleep at night because they were afraid of the world and didn’t understand basic scientific principles. If your religion had any value, kids would “get it” intuitively. If it has no value, you’ll need to force-feed them and threaten them and indoctrinate them at very young ages so they don’t ask questions and pass on the nonsense without thinking about it. Sad at best, abusive at worst. I am at least glad to see that you are the only one foolish enough to write such hateful gibberish. Religion is on its way out in the civilized world. Now, Iran, Iraq, etc. - that’s another story.

By John Scopes

August 1, 2011 2:44 PM | Link to this

Is it any wonder that the country is being driven off a cliff when those who shout the loudest and are most certain of the validity of their beliefs as fact all sound like “Squirrellygirl”? In the 1940s, 50s and 60s, science was respected. Young people were encouraged to study the sciences and prepare for careers that were highly regarded. Children dreamed about becoming astronauts, not as a rebuke of their parents’ religion but as a way to further human understanding of the world and what lies beyond it. Today, scientists are presented by some as nothing more than corrupt, agenda-driven ideologues, hell-bent on duping the rest of us into believing lies. Should we be surprised that, in terms of educational attainment, our country is rapidly joining the ranks of the mediocre? How sad for us, and for our children, who will have to live with the legacy we create for them.

By bub

August 1, 2011 2:27 PM | Link to this

Another huge embarrassment for Springboro. Unbelievable that this Kohl’s woman has been able to leverage this much influence in the community. Tea Party central…what a shame. When are people going to wake up and realize they are being led by the lunatic fringe??? COme on Springboro - grow a pair and stand up for the individual, stop supporting this radical group…vote them out!!

By Squirrellygirl

August 1, 2011 2:25 PM | Link to this

Either teach it all or teach none of it. I say teach none of it, no more theories of evolution! My opinion is that children should be able to discuss anything since this is supposed to be a free country. But I personally don’t want to pay teachers, whose morals I can’t check out, to teach my child about sex or religion. Most people (including teachers) haven’t even read all the books of the Bible, so how can they be properly prepared to teach something from which they don’t know anything about, that they are ignorant about, something to which they can only form their own opinions from what other people SAY the Bible says? PINK FLOYD HAD IT RIGHT: “LEAVE OUR KIDS ALONE!” And if my previous comments were printed, you can read for yourself why sex education should never be allowed to be taught by “teachers”—some of which are deviants, untrustworthy, left leaning, and with a socialist agenda. Parents be on the alert that deviant behavior can be happening at your local school. This happened at Stebbins High School when my daughter was in school (she’s 35 now). Her “teacher” told her to draw two men having sex on the chalkboard. That is not sex education. That is harassment, and that teacher should have been imprisoned for it. I’ll bet you he’s still out there teaching YOUR kids. Maybe he’ll teach them oral sex next. You comfortable with that? It happened in a elementary school in another state (I can’t recall where it was, but it was in the newspapers a couple of weeks ago). Think about it. Unions keep those bad teachers from being fired. Think about that, too.

By Christian, Muslim, Jew -- which one are you?

August 1, 2011 2:22 PM | Link to this

Squirrelly — since the Constitution guarantees separation of Church and State, we have spent NO money “sanitizing” anything. Are you going to teach “Christianity” in your science classes? As in, Jesus could walk on water/heal the sick? Should we stop teaching math because it doesn’t mention God? What you don’t understand is that if you go with one religion, you necessarily exclude all of the others, not just atheism. Therefore advancing no one religion protects your right to practice your particular faith without the threat of persecution/prosecution. And since this is established law, YOU are wasting “taxpayers” money by trying to force the issue.

By Squirrellygirl

August 1, 2011 1:28 PM | Link to this

How much of our tax money has been spent wiping all mention of God (except for when it is about Muslims) out of our textbooks, out of schools? How much of our tax money was used “sanitizing” our text books from all references of God from our forefathers? How much of our tax money was spent rewriting our history, removing all negative references of socialism, marxism, communism? What happened to the facts about what happened in the U.S. under Presidents Wilson and Roosevelt? The racism? Home school your children. Don’t let the socialist teachers lie to your children, call evolution a science, and tell your children that God isn’t real.

By Teach it!

August 1, 2011 1:27 PM | Link to this

Well, the evolution was created!

By Squirrellygirl

August 1, 2011 1:15 PM | Link to this

Is this the funnies? Cartoons? Evolution is a science? Who said that? Can you make anything a science? Like the science of monkeys fighting dinosaurs? That would be amusing. Socialists believe they came from monkeys. Seriously funny stuff here in the cartoon section of the DDN…you want civil? How about fair and balanced reporting, there, Christopher? Do you believe in balanced and fair reporting, Christopher? If you can make a theory like evolution a science, then I can make socialist monkeys fighting dinosaurs a science, too. That includes socialist teachers, but they are a subset of the socialist monkeys. This is the funnies at DDN! Socialist monkeys telling parents who pay their salaries that the parents don’t have the right to homeschool their children? You call that civil, Mr. Magan, or is that Mrs. Magan? You want proof of religion, of God? You will get your proof when you die.

By Squirrellygirl

August 1, 2011 1:07 PM | Link to this

Jeremy, I want you to conduct a scientific experiment. Think back on your short life. Have you had any near misses with death? Who’s name did you call out when this happened? Uh huh.

By Squirrellygirl

August 1, 2011 1:04 PM | Link to this

Personally, I would like our schools to stop teaching evolutionism, because it isn’t believable, it isn’t science, it is a theory. It take more faith to believe in evolution than it does God. And since God has been taken out of the classroom, we are now dealing with a lot worse. Should I list what has happened since God has been outlawed in school? Do you have police patrolling your schools? How many of your females are pregnant? Has anyone been stabbed at school lately? Uh huh… but you teachers are soooooo smart, yes you are!

By Squirrellygirl

August 1, 2011 1:00 PM | Link to this

Christopher Magan, are you only printing the comments you agree with? This is a Christian nation, whether you agree with it or not. We were created under Christian/Judaic principles. I won’t argue with the socialists that they come from monkeys, but don’t you dare tell me that those monkeys can tell me I don’t have a right to teach my children they were created in God’s image. This DDN paper is so biased, it’s not even funny anymore. It would be more funny if you would post my comments though. Seriously, these socialists think they are intellectually superior to people who believe in God. Evolution a science? What kind of science would that be, and how do you prove it? Is ignorance bliss, Christopher Magan?

By ShowMeYourTail,Anne

August 1, 2011 12:56 PM | Link to this

“Evolution is a fact. Until you grasp that there’s really no point in having a conversation.” Okay, I call your bluff, Anne. Show me your tail. Evolution was never a fact, but you are still a monkey, Anne.

By Squirrellygirl

August 1, 2011 12:54 PM | Link to this

They came to our country fleeing religious persecution. They prayerfully considered our laws, and created balances of power, America! Now, socialists who are truly Unamerican want to take away our rights to be parents, our rights to instruct our children, our right to worship in the way we see fit. Maybe the Socialists/ Marxists/Communists came from monkeys? Maybe they should be kept in cages? They think they are smarter than the rest of us. In reality, the Bible says “A FOOL has said in his heart that there is no God”—I think God is smarter than the monkey socialists/ communists/marxists.

By Squirrellygirl

August 1, 2011 12:47 PM | Link to this

What would you consider proof of creationism? Multiple prophecies that were fulfilled to the letter? How about the dead sea scrolls? How about that little war between Israel and everybody else where Israel won? Can you explain away all of the miracles? Where is your proof of evolutionism? Even scientists don’t agree, so you can’t call evolution science. Just know this: if there is a fake one, there is a real one. And everything came from somewhere, and that somewhere came from somewhere, until get to God. Here’s a little story from the Bible. A king called himself God. God slew the king. (No more king.) The morale of the story is NEVER call yourself God! Goodbye!

By karon

August 1, 2011 12:40 PM | Link to this

Religion should stay out of schools. Kids that go to public schools come from all different backgrounds and religions! Actually school is about learning and not about sports or teaching about something personal such as religion!

By Squirrellygirl

August 1, 2011 12:39 PM | Link to this

to: A History Lesson. I would like to ban people who believe in banning parental control. Does that make sense? I think it does! Who do you think you are telling parents you want to ban homeschooling so that parents can’t teach their children about religion? You don’t belong in a free country. You need to learn your lessons the hard way. Please please please move to Iran so that they can make you cover yourself head to foot and not be allowed to speak. You speak foolishness anyway! Go to Iran, please! Then you can live in your God free world with people that will stone you for not having enough witnesses to you being raped. Maybe a stoning would teach you a lesson! You don’t deserve to live in America with your socialism. Our servicemen died so that you could tell parents here in America they don’t have a right to teach their kids about God? Really? Please go live under Chavez’ rule. You need to. You’ll like it there. Please go, soon!

By Squirrellygirl

August 1, 2011 12:34 PM | Link to this

You want intelligence? Everything came from somewhere. If you say it is the big bang, then where did it come from initially? I don’t believe in evolution. I do believe in God. I believe it takes more faith to believe in evolution than God. Common sense tells you we came from somewhere. There had to be a creator. Did you know that God takes the weak things to confound the mighty? Good luck, might evolutioners. You might have come from monkeys, but I came from human ancestors who came from Adam’s rib. Adam’s rib came from Adam. Adam came from the dirt of earth, which God created. God created the heavens and the earth. God made us in His image. We are all created in his image, and He gave us all a measure of faith. What you do with that faith is up to you. Waste it on your fake science. Here’s a secret for scientists: True science will always match God’s word. Always. If it doesn’t match, your science is wrong, your math is wrong, you are wrong. It isn’t okay with me that teachers are putting evolution out there as a science instead of a theory. Then they hide creationism from their students because it doesn’t agree with their fake science. It’s a good thing God hasn’t been banished from the internet! God gave you a will to make your choice. He gave you good sense, common sense, so…where did the first monkey that you came from come from, Evolutionist Monkeys?

By SpringboroDad

August 1, 2011 12:28 PM | Link to this

This is an embarrassment to the residents of Springboro. I want my church to help instruct my children about Christ, and the schools to instruct them on science. A public school classroom is not the place for discussions of Christ, Buddha, Yahweh, Allah or any other diety. The Tea Party and Republicans in general need to stay on message and not get bogged down in nonsensical issues of gay marriage and religion in public schools.

By Believer

August 1, 2011 12:20 PM | Link to this

God is THE CREATOR. Period.

By Laura

August 1, 2011 12:19 PM | Link to this

With the US ranking 21st internationally in science education, how is it a good idea to waste even more instructional time teaching creationism in the science classroom? If a literature, history, or comparative religion class wants to include creation mythology, fine, but creationism has no place in a public school science classroom.If parents like Ms. Kohls want their children to learn creationism in science class, they should either homeschool them or send them to a private religious school.

By Chris Toker

August 1, 2011 12:09 PM | Link to this

I understand the importance if seperation of church and state. However i Do in fact they should talk about religion. But on a diffrent level. Make a class For Awareness in Say… High school. Inform and educate the young impressional minds instead of forcing religion. expand on ALL religions. Even Penticostal Muslim Jihasists.then maby we can begin understanding religion a lot better.

By Todd

August 1, 2011 12:00 PM | Link to this

I find it ironic that many fundamentalists who push for “creationism” being taught in school are often the same sort who object to sex education being taught in school. Stupid is as stupid does.

By Boro neighbor

August 1, 2011 11:57 AM | Link to this

SOS - well said, I couldn’t agree more!

By Jeremy

August 1, 2011 11:50 AM | Link to this

A scientific theory is much more than just an opinion. Suggesting that intelligent design is just as valid as evolution because they’re both theories betrays a lack of scientific understanding.

By History lesson

August 1, 2011 11:31 AM | Link to this

There is a reason why we have a separation of church and state in this country. I don’t believe that the Bible is literally true, and I would like to prevent your differing opinions from being advanced. I don’t want my kids coming home with ideas about dinosaurs eating cavemen. Would you want the public school system (me) to ban the teaching of creationism (lack of empiricism) in your religion classes? I would also love to ban “homeschooling” as it prevents children from properly socializing (child abuse), and therefore advances dangerous fundamentalism, such as you are demonstrating.

By Scott

August 1, 2011 11:16 AM | Link to this

In 1987, the United States Supreme Court held in Edwards v. Aguillard (482 U.S. 578) that it is unconstitutional to require the teaching of creation science. In subsequent rulings, district courts held that individual teachers may not advocate creation science (for example, Webster v. New Lenox School District #122, 917 F. 2d. 1004; John E. Peloza v. Capistrano Unified School District, 37 F. 3d. 517). For someone who espouses to support cost effective education in Springboro, it seems incongruent that she would espouse for the teaching of creationism as part of the science curriculum in Springboro schools which would surely result in a large expensive lawsuit that would strike down any creationist curriculum based on previous precedent at the federal, state, and appelate levels.

By Fine with me

August 1, 2011 11:12 AM | Link to this

Why not teach it? No one knows for sure!

By Why not?

August 1, 2011 11:08 AM | Link to this

Since no one knows anything ” for sure”, why not teach it? Everyone is guessing any way!

By Anne

August 1, 2011 10:58 AM | Link to this

Evolution is a fact. Until you grasp that there’s really no point in having a conversation.

By Aesop

August 1, 2011 10:38 AM | Link to this

The ignorance of this request is stunning. Biology is a science class which teaches principles based on the scientific method of discovery. There is absolutely no tenet of creationism that has been proven using scientific methods. By it’s very definition it is beyond science to prove. There is absolute no rational for this to be taught in any science class. It can be broached in religion classes if need be. Ms. Kohl’s and Mr. Anderson’s ignorance of science is pathetic. Neither deserves to serve on a school board.

By Sissy

August 1, 2011 10:38 AM | Link to this

Most of your comments are one-sided and clearly not thought out prior to posting. Creation and Science: two entirely diffent OPINIONS! Apple and Oranges people. Teach one you have to teach the other.

By Christopher Magan

August 1, 2011 10:06 AM | Link to this

This is just a reminder that comments on this blog are approved before being posted. Please be patient and remember to stay on topic and be civil.

By Not there yet

August 1, 2011 9:54 AM | Link to this

Just as evolution is a THEORY, intelligent design is a THEORY also. What’s the big deal?

By John hopson

August 1, 2011 9:54 AM | Link to this

50 years ago, I was taught creationism in public school. It was in a class called “World History” in a section called “Religions of the World”. We learned the creation myths of the Greeks, Romans, Hindus, Jews,and others (all of which were different). We learned about evolution in Science class. Why, well evolution has anthropological evidence, genetic evidence, observational evidence, I.E. it is science. Christian creationism is a story, in a book, that was passed down for hundreds of generations around campfires by people who smoked and drank various substances to to feel mystical. The final written version in the Bible is actually a corruption of a much older Assyrian myth. Does this sound like a “theory” that should be taught in science class?

By Paul Lambert

August 1, 2011 9:50 AM | Link to this

I think of it this way: science is the process of answering questions that start with “How?” Religion in the process of answering questions that start with “Why?” It would be difficult to argue that DNA exists and natural selection takes place. But if we wind the evolutionary clock all the way back to the Big Bang, isn’t there still a lot of questions. I think part of a good education is posing these kinds of questions to kids as well. No one can produce a factual answer to these “Why?” questions, but that doesn’t mean they shouldn’t be asked and pondered…

By ntts

August 1, 2011 9:47 AM | Link to this

Here we go again… If instruction is limited to one religion, then that is proselytizing. That’s fine, if you do it in your church. A religious studies class would be good if it fairly depicted ALL religions. Leave it up to a conservative to be willing to spend a ton of taxpayer money to defend a losing proposition in court.

By This is why levies fail

August 1, 2011 9:42 AM | Link to this

Creationism, huh? Well, this is why levies fail. Community members have serious doubts about the educational value received for tax dollars invested. #####################ANOTHER EXAMPLE: I live in Beavercreek, and feel that Beavercreek Schools suck. They don’t educate, but merely “teach the test” so that standardized test scores make the system look good on paper. Constantly asking for more money, the school system admin can’t even produce a well-written newsletter. The finances are far from transparent, and the administration seems to cultivate an adversarial relationship with teachers and community alike. I’m sick of supporting them, as are many members of the community.

By Silent Service

August 1, 2011 9:37 AM | Link to this

The problem is not teaching about religion, it’s teaching a religious belief as if it has scientific validity. You can teach theocracy in a social studies class on comparitive religion as long as you give an equal accounting of various common religions. You just can’t teach Creation as a serious science because it has no serious supporting science behind it. Just an assurtion of faith.

By SOS

August 1, 2011 9:30 AM | Link to this

Parents that wish their children to receive religious instruction should not look to the public schools for such instruction. Religious beliefs do not have to be taught in public schools, but neither should they be ignored….Ms. Kohls should provide the district with her own cost/benefit analysis and justification/rational for creationism education. She should have to make the case as to why the students of the district benefit. This “request” is nothing more than pandering to her political constituency.

By cowalker

August 1, 2011 9:23 AM | Link to this

Of course. It would be totally fiscally responsible to involve an Ohio school district in an expensive court battle over the school’s right to push a religious agenda in the curriculum. And if the school district wins this right, I hope they’re OK with teachers introducing the concept that the creator might as easily be called Allah, Gaia, Krishna, Yahweh, Zeus, Jupiter, Odin or Goddess as “God.” This pathetic, and the parents in this district should be outraged that school board members are trying to put the children at an academic disadvantage when it comes to the study of science.